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Date: Saturday, 26 February 1994 03:00 est
From: homebrew-request at HPFCMI.FC.HP.COM (Request Address Only - No Articles)
Subject: Homebrew Digest #1359 (February 26, 1994)
Reply-To: homebrew at HPFCMI.FC.HP.COM (Posting Address Only - No Requests)
To: homebrew at HPFCMI.FC.HP.COM
Errors-To: [email protected]
Precedence: bulk

HOMEBREW Digest #1359 Sat 26 February 1994

Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

3 gal batches/Czech pils yeast (Jim Grady)
brewing supplies mail order list (Tom Pratt)
RIMS (Michael Burgeson)
yeast from trub (sekearns)
Creemore Springs Recipie wanted (Doug Burden)
plastic buckets ("OWEN S. BAMFORD")
re: Rhino stout (The Rider) (Michael Fetzer)
re: Rhino stout (The Rider) (Michael Fetzer)
hydrometers, nerds, and antiquity (philosophy ramble) (Dick Dunn)
B-Brite ?'s (ELTEE)
"The Great Pumpkin Beer" (Brian Schlueter)
Ice beer (Jon Petty)
Brewing; the Art of Cooking vs. Science ("Pamela J. Day 7560")
British Malt in German Beer ("CANNON_TOM")
Bitterness, Keg Kettles ("Manning Martin MP")
Drilling Stainless (Bob_McIlvaine)
Brewer's Digest and Campus Libraries (Derek Sheehan)
Re: Wheat Crud ("Glen A. Wagnecz, X6616")
Re: Pub Lists/etc. (Jeff Frane)
NO-WELD boiler ("Glen A. Wagnecz, X6616")
sanitizing crockery (Carl Howes)
Brewpub list (Jeff Frane)
Blowoff hoses (korz)
Techno-weenie books (korz)
Reinheitsgebot ("Ronald E. Gill")
New Club at U. of Md. ("Ronald E. Gill")
Contest Announcement (Loren Carter)
brewpubs and beer (BadAssAstronomer)
Ice Beer (Thomas_Tills.Henr801h)
wyeast 2308 (btalk)
Reinheitsgebot (Tim Anderson)
Old coffee-machine Auto-spargers. (GANDE)
Recipes, etc. ("Dale Leidheiser")

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Date: Thu, 24 Feb 94 17:15:36 EST
From: Jim Grady
Subject: 3 gal batches/Czech pils yeast

Two things:

In HBD #1356, Mike Hansen asks about 3 gal batches. I made 3 gal of
Porter the other weekend because it was the first time I made porter and
so I could stay inside while I did it. There were two problems:
- I have been spoiled by my cajun cooker and could not get nearly the
"rolling boil" I am now used to,
- it was so good, I wish I had more than 3 gal of it.

On another note, I am building up a starter of the new Wyeast Czech Pils
yeast (#2278) and have noticed that there is a LOT of diacetyl being
produced and that it does not pack down very well at all (I guess this
means it is a poor flocculator). I have been equivocating about what
temp to grow the starter at and I was wondering if the high-low-high
temps may have something to do with the high diacetyl levels. (high =
65^F, low=52^F). The smell of butter almost knocks me over when I take
off the airlock to give the yeasties more food.

Has anybody else tried this yeast yet? What has your experience been
w.r.t. diacetyl & flocculation?
- --
Jim Grady
[email protected]


Date: Thu, 24 Feb 1994 15:50:33 +0800
From: [email protected] (Tom Pratt)
Subject: brewing supplies mail order list

I've been told a list of mail order outfits who sell brewing
supplies has made its way around here before. Well, I missed it.
Can someone perhaps forward me a copy, or send me the name and
phone number of your favorite mail order supplier?


[email protected]


Date: Thu, 24 Feb 94 18:31:34 PST
From: [email protected] (Michael Burgeson)
Subject: RIMS

I had some requests for further info on the RIMS system I'm using. It
is rather lengthy, so if you want to know more about my implementation,
email me, and I will be happy to send you a description.

And, Mike McCaw, I got the following email address for you (which bounces):,@Sun. Please send your (ungarbled) email address.

- --mik


Date: Thu, 24 Feb 1994 19:07:30 -0800
From: [email protected]
Subject: yeast from trub

Thanks to all who provided advice about the recycling of yeast, I have
been successfull.
If I have a quart jar full of clean yeast, how many batches should/could
this be used for? (5 gallon batches) How does one know?
Thanks very much.

Matt Rademacher
[email protected]


Date: Thu, 24 Feb 1994 21:53:00 -0500
From: [email protected] (Doug Burden)
Subject: Creemore Springs Recipie wanted

Does anyone have a recipie for Creemore Springs?
Doug Burden


Date: Thu, 24 Feb 1994 23:31:24 -0500 (EST)
Subject: plastic buckets

Derek Sheehan wrote to ask what was so awful about using plastic buckets
for primary fermentation, and went on to say that he had excellent
results from plastic. So do I. Some oxygen probably does diffuse through
the sides, but not enough to matter, and in any case the wort is
saturated with CO2 and can't take up much oxygen. Camden tablets and
citric acid seem to do an adequate job of disinfecting. Boiling water
works well too, and is quite safe on polypropylene. Stainless steel looks
good and is probably easier to clean, but for home brewing in 4-gallon
lots, plastic is fine. Just make sure it's food grade and doesn't have
nasty toxic plasticizers that can leach out into your beer.
On the same subject... those 2-liter soda bottles are easy to sterilize,
lightweight, tough, and pressure-tight. They may not be stylish but they
make bottling quick and easy. True, the pressure does go down when you
open them, so the beer has to be finished fairly quickly, but this has
never been much of a problem.


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 00:48:07 -0800
From: [email protected] (The Rider) (Michael Fetzer)
Subject: re: Rhino stout

> My questions are:
> 1. How do I extrapolate this for a five gallon batch?
> 2. Does anyone out there in brewland have a phone number/contact
> at Wyeast?
> 3. What is the best way to gather yeast from the bottom of a
> container? (Which is what I might have to do should phone call
> fail.)
> 4. What is meant by Cent.?
> Any help from the HBD Brewmeisters will be greatly appreciated and
> final results will be posted. This stout is one of the finest I
> have ever tasted. It ranks right up there with (please God don't
> strike this fine Irish head dead) Guinness Stout!

Hi Jack...

Duncan Saffir, brewmaster at the McMenamins on Allen and Murray, has indeed
told me that they do use the same strain of yeast for all their beers. This
seems rather common, for example Sierra Nevada does it too. I don't know
what strain of yeast McM uses, but it should be easy to find out.

1. To extrapolate this, I would just divide by 44. As long as boil times
and concentrations are the same, you should get roughly the same results.
Your biggest problem is going to be extraction rate... after the first
batch, you can compare your OG to theirs, and then make another adjustment.
Say you end up w/ 60 points, and they with 70... you need to increase your
malt by 15% then. Not the hops, tho.

2. No idea off hand, tho I would think it's on every package of wyeast.
Sometimes they seem to sell under the label 'Brewer's Choice', I think.

3. I assume you're talking about buying some of their beer bulk, letting it
settle out, and using the yeast? Well, I've done this w/ Sierra Nevada
before. Just swirl the sediment and pour into a standard gravity (40
points) starter medium. You might want to start with a small volume, and
pitch into larger starters several times. I usually do pop my Wyeast, pour
into 250ml starter, and after a day into 500ml starter. Then into the brew.

4. Centennial hops. Steinbart's should have them readily available.


- --
Michael Fetzer pgp 2.2 key available on request
Internet: [email protected] uucp: ...!ucsd!mfetzer


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 00:48:25 -0800
From: [email protected] (The Rider) (Michael Fetzer)
Subject: re: Rhino stout

Oh, btw... you missed a wonderful Brew Crew meeting the other day in
Beaverton. Fred Eckhardt himself conducted the annual chocolate and beer
tasting and Mozart listening. 🙂 Most of the beers were excellent,
unfortunately I'm prejudiced when it comes to chocolates. But they had some
excellent ones as well.

Next meeting will be at Steinbarts again, nothing fancy, on 10 March. The
one after at a new brewpub downtown on 14 April. Good night to get drunk, I

They have a hotline to call, 288-BREW, for info on meetings. Hope to see
ya at one of these sometime, or maybe we can get together for a beer out
here. The fellow that brews at the McMenamin on Allen and Murray is a
pretty good friend of mine, I'm sure he'd be amenable to helping you out
brewing a baby rhino.

Take care...


- --
Michael Fetzer pgp 2.2 key available on request
Internet: [email protected] uucp: ...!ucsd!mfetzer


Date: 25 Feb 94 01:40:49 MST (Fri)
From: [email protected] (Dick Dunn)
Subject: hydrometers, nerds, and antiquity (philosophy ramble)

While I agree with folks that we HBD folk sometimes have a tendency to
"nerd out" on equipment, I don't think it's a useful response to say that
everything should be done "seat of the pants". The difference between good
beer and great beer is sometimes a matter of relatively minor factors. To
someone not yet accustomed to it all, a few gadgets may make it easier to
hit the target, with fewer bad batches in the beginning.

The appeal to antiquity--"people made beer for centuries without this
stuff"--may not be as accurate as you think, either. For example, folks
didn't have nicely calibrated glass hydrometers and jars, but they *did*
have the equivalent of a hydrometer and they *did* check gravities. In
the "Kenelme Digby" recipes, printed around 1670, the common technique
seems to have been to float a fresh egg in the wort and note how high it
floated. Here's a check for gravity of a metheglin must:
"...then put in as much of the best Honey you can get, as will bear an
egg to the breadth of two-pence ; that is, till you can see no more of
the egg above the water then a two-pence will cover..."
Other recipes use (probably more accurately) the vertical extent of the
floating portion of the egg--as, for example, "the breadth of a groat."
They used what they could get, and they made fairly accurate measurements
(for the time) with it.

What I'm getting at is that the tools have changed but the concerns
haven't. If you don't want to use a hydrometer, fine--it really *isn't*
necessary if you know what you're doing. But remember that it *can* be a
help, and people have been using hydrometer-equivalents for centuries. If
you're starting out, get one. Set it aside when/if you no longer feel you
need it, but don't let the tools control you by either their presence or
their absence.

Moreover, it's true that people made beer for centuries (millenia, even)
without any fancy aids, but it's also the case that brewing used to be a
normal home activity. Everyone was exposed to it from youth on, so they
had day-to-day experience with the process. They didn't suddenly wake up
in their early 20's to the realization that they could make beer, and have
to start from scratch. (You can think of what we're doing in HBD as over-
coming cultural deprivation.:-) Moreover, they had a lot more bad beer
back then than we want to deal with now!

Taking another angle on this: I've brewed now and then for about 15 years.
I use some recipes and about an average number of gadgets. But when I bake
bread, the only things I really measure are yeast if I use pre-measured
packets, and oven temperature. Ingredient measures really are "this much
in the hand" of salt and "a glop like this" of oil, "yo much" water, and
so on. Now, several points about this, relevant to brewing:
* I've been making bread for 35 years. Along the way, it's gotten to
where I don't need to measure ingredients, use a thermometer on the
liquid for the yeast, time the rising, etc. That doesn't mean these
factors aren't checked; it just means I have enough experience to know
them without a measuring device. And yes, I screwed up enough along
the often as not even *with* recipes.
* I don't try for close uniformity from one batch to the next. I say to
myself something like "OK, tonight I want something with some oat
sweetness, tender crust [adjust fat], rich [maybe an egg, mental cor-
rection on water],..." You can do this with brewing too, once you have
enough batches under your belt [that's a sadly relevant phrase in
physiological terms, isn't it?:-] to know how to stay within the bounds
of what's "palatable", "balanced"... Of course, to any commercial
brewer (even your favorite micro-pub), batch-to-batch variation is not
only anathema, but ruinous to revenue.
* I can't teach anyone to make bread effectively, because by now so much
of the process is intuitive that I don't know what to describe. It
would be a lot easier if I were less sure of myself. You may work
intuitively, but you can't teach intuition.
- ---
Dick Dunn [email protected] -or- raven!rcd Boulder, Colorado USA
...Mr Natural says, "Get the right tool for the job!"


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 05:57:08 -0500 (EST)
From: [email protected]
Subject: B-Brite ?'s

I am using B-Brite for the first time instead of bleach. Should I let it
dry or rinse it? I have a batch of stout in my secondary that I cleaned
with B-Brite. The outside has a few milky stains where I didn't wipe it
off. I did thoroughly rinse the carboy, but I have something similiar
INSIDE the carboy. It's even below the level of the beer. It's a ribbed
carboy and it's right below both ribs and it'a definately on the inside. Is
this from the B-brite?

hoppy brewing

Ken Bair [email protected]


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 21:07:27 +0000 (JST)
From: Brian Schlueter
Subject: "The Great Pumpkin Beer"

Forwarded message:
>From schluetb Fri Feb 25 21:05 JST 1994


Category : Herb & Spice
Method : Extract
Starting Gravity : 1.050
Ending Gravity : 1.011
Alcohol content : 5.0%
Recipe Makes : 5.0 gallons.
Age Beer : 2 weeks.

"The Great Pumpkin" Beer

5.5 gal Water

5 Ibs Amber Malt (Dry Extract)
14 grams Ale Yeast
1 tsp Irish Moss
16 oz Can Pumpkin (Libbys, w/o preservatives)
3/4 cup Corn Sugar
4 oz Washington Cascade Hops
3 sticks Cinnamon
1 tsp Nutmeg (ground)

In a stainless kettle (24qt or more) mix water & Malt, Heat to rolling boil.
At boil start timer,(total time of 60 min.), add the following:

at 30 min. add Hops & Irish Moss
at 40 min. add Cinnamon and Nutmeg
at 50 min. add Pumpkin

At 60 min. remove from heat and begin wort chiller, Chill to 100 F and
transfer to primary fermenter. Take sample for gravity reading. Pitch yeast
or yeast starter as suggested. Ferment (always closed) in the primary for
the first 24 hours then transfer to secondary. Check gravity 2 days later,
looking for a F.G. of 1.010 - 1.012. When reaching F.G. transfer to mixing
container and add Corn Sugar for priming, then bottle. Age 2-3 weeks before

*Suggestion- Make a yeast starter batch:
Remove 1 cup of wort (malt & water only!)at 30 min.
mark and cover with aluminum foil, then poke the
thermometer though foil and put the container in
a ice water bath to chill. Target temperature is
95 F. When reaching 95 F remove from ice water bath
and pitch the yeast, then cover with foil.

Comments: We use this recipe during Thanksgiving and Halloween party's, the
alcohol comes out to about 5%. Make it for all your friends so they
can enjoy "The Great Pumpkin".

This recipe was created by, Bob Knapp & Brian Schlueter of
Okinawa, Japan. Kam Pia ! (Drink be happy)


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 7:45:23 EST
From: Jon Petty
Subject: Ice beer

Someone asked about ice beer recently. On this side of the Atlantic, Ice
Beer is mostly just another gimicky Madison Ave term to sell cheap beer;
like "COLD FILTERED" (almost all beers are filtered and it ain't done hot) or
"DRY" (different hops used). In the case of Bud Ice, they use corn syrup
instead of rice, (cheaper) and the beer is dropped below 32 deg after
fermentation ( although nothing is removed).


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 08:15:00 EST
From: "Pamela J. Day 7560"
Subject: Brewing; the Art of Cooking vs. Science

Hello all,
I guess I just can't resist jumping into the fray...
I've found that cooking and brewing are two very similar ARTS.
There doesn't have to be any science involved in either to get great
results. How many world-class chefs out there are chemists? I am a
scientist and I leave my chemistry, microbiology and all other
scientific references at work where they belong. I brew like I cook,
(so far my camping buddies haven't complained, they buy, I cook) I
use recipes as a guide, not gospel, if it doesn't sound good, I
substitute. I use my hydrometer only to get an idea of how potent
my brew may be, and I never worry. When you start getting uptight about
your beer it will taste "stressed".
Laura, if you want to write a brewbook for the non-technical
e-mail me back, I'd love to help.
Ok control freaks flame at will, but keep it to private e-mail,
sniveling only clutters the digest.


[email protected]


Date: 25 Feb 94 08:25:00 EST
Subject: British Malt in German Beer

Message Creation Date was at 25-FEB-1994 08:25:00

Our Brewheat Mash Tun crapped out on us while we were
brewing our Maibock two weeks ago, and this presents a
problem in that we are due to brew a Maerzen soon, and we
have no easy way to step infuse our undermodified German
Malt save fixing or reaquiring a mash tun (stove top mashing
would be difficult because we stagger step 5 gallon batches
and I don't have enough burners on the stove for

My question is what about a cooler single step mash for the
Maerzen with well modified British two row malt? Besides
the obvious (Britsh Malt is a little darker than German Pils
malt, and BRITISH MALT in GERMAN BEER!!!!!) whats the
collective wisdom on substituting British Grain for German
Grain in an Oktoberfest style beer (assuming we will use a
good lager yeast and the correct fermentation temperatures)?

Tom Cannon
DH Brewery
Fairfax/Annandale VA


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 09:00:13 -0500
From: [email protected]
Subject: Zima

In #1358, Glenn wrote:

> you can tell from a hop tea. Add a little honey and vodka and
> we might have something that could compete with Zima :-0

Make that "blow away" Zima. A Zima rep ran into me last week and
suggested that I have a taste. UGH! PTOOEY! ACK!! PFFT!! If
I'd wanted a fruit-flavored bottled water, I'd have gotten a
Clearly Canadian or whatever they're called. And they stoop to
putting the word malt on the bottle to try to lure in the
unsuspecting. This is just another alcohol delivery system for
the boogie till ya puke set. Anyone with even a modicum of
appreciation for REAL malt beverages should be highly offended by
this product.

Just my $.02
[email protected]


Date: 25 Feb 1994 09:27:39 U
From: "Manning Martin MP"
Subject: Bitterness, Keg Kettles

I would like to clarify the statement made by Scott Wisler about a balanced

IBU/OG curve; I didn't derive it, merely plotted data collected by Quinten
Smith and published in Zymurgy (special hop issue?... I cant remember
exactly). In any case I have found this to be a useful sanity check when
designing recipes. Smith had to make some BIG assumptions to produce the
data, but it seems to be representative. I have superimposed the ranges of
IBU and OG for all of the AHA style guidelines on this plot, and find
generally that the hoppier ones are above the line, and the maltier ones are

On IBU formulas and complaints that some are complicated, I disagree. They
are all the same and simple: eIBU = (weight(g) x %alpha x 1000 x
Utilization)/Batch Size(l). The complex part is determining the Utilization
:-). I had fun playing with Mark's hop alpha deterioration formulas. They
illustrate how important it is to keep your hops at as low a temperature as
possible, regardless of whether they're in barrier bags, poly bags or paper

W A Kuhn asks about keg kettles. The March-April Brewing Techniques has an
article describing my design and thoughts on kettle features in general. It
should be on the street in a week or two.



Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 10:00:11 EST
From: [email protected] (RONALD DWELLE)

As an alternative to the hose & clamp--
I found a store-bought siphon in the hardware department,
advertised for siphoning kerosene. It has a tube you stick in the
carboy, a cheapie plastic bellows-like pump, and an exit tube. It
was like $2.99 on sale. I'm sure it's not foodgrade plastic, but
I sanitize it and the beer is only momentarily in contact with
it. (Maybe the plastic is leaching out some chromosome killer,
but I haven't noticed any twitching yet.) The inlet tube required
some adapting to get an extension to reach the bottom of the
carboy, but the outlet was standard diameter (maybe 3/8"?) and I
put my normal plastic siphon hose on it. Works.
Anecdote: in the olden days (70s) I and everybody else used to
just suck on the hose to get the siphon going, and in general
sanitation was ignored. Lots of polluted batches as a result. The
most hugest quantum improvement in homebrewing in the last 25
years (imho) is sanitizing stuff. Now, I'm maybe paranoid but the
less I can touch/breathe-on/expose everything, the happier my
beer is.
Cheers, (Ron Dwelle, [email protected])


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 10:15:08 EST
From: [email protected]
Subject: Drilling Stainless

Drilling stainless is just not the same as drilling
normal steel. A sharp bit is a must. A High Speed
Steel bit is adequate. For larger holes the relief
angle can be modified if you plan to drill many

It will also help to use a lubricant. I use a 60/40
mix of chain saw oil and kerosene. This is mainly
used to remove excess heat, so apply continuously
while drilling (stainless doesn't dissipate heat well,
you get a localized heat build-up at the tip of the



Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 08:34:11 -0700
From: [email protected] (Derek Sheehan)
Subject: Brewer's Digest and Campus Libraries

Dear All,

Thanks for all the replies! I got a lot of mail from ".com" people who,
politely, pointed out that they were not students and can't get access to
university libraries. I did some checking of the Montana University system
and they will allow ANY Montana citizen access to ANY Montana university
library. The access privileges are just like an undergraduate. I ugre
you'all to determine what your nearest university library policy is. You
may be surprised. I have also found a collection of books on brewing and
brewing science. Anyone interested in the chemical changes of hops during
the brewing process?

I received a current American Chemical Society book catalog yesterday and
the ACS has published a book,"Beer and Wine Production: Analysis,
Characterization and Technological Advances" by Barry H. Gump (ISBN
0-8412-2724-1, $24.95). This book may be on the side of "hard science" and
confusing for the non-chemist, BUT there are chapters on homebrewing! I
intend to purchase this book and post a review. If anyone is interested,
the ACS number is 1-800-227-5558.


- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Derek Sheehan [email protected] "Better Living Through
Montana State University - Chemistry Chemistry"
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
- --


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 11:52:23 EST
From: "Glen A. Wagnecz, X6616"
Subject: Re: Wheat Crud

Lowell Hart asks about: Subject: Wheat Crud

>YOW! I did my first mash with wheat malt last night, and wound up with
the ugliest gray crud I've ever seen in a layer across the top of
my mash/lauter cooler...
So what's the deal with this layer of grunge?

Again, the age-old advice of relax-don't worry is applicable.
My last wheat batch was near 70% wheat, and you should have seen the
scum that I scooped of the top of the boil! It will clean off mostly
with hot H20, a little scrubbing. The stuff you skim from the boil
(and the hot/cold break for that matter) should not be thrown down
the drain, as it will do a number on your pipes that will take a
healthy dose of draino to fix.

Don't be alarmed at cloudy wheat brews, especially if you don't
filter. Age them a couple weeks (or more) and the taste will be there...



Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 09:07:35 -0800 (PST)
From: [email protected] (Jeff Frane)
Subject: Re: Pub Lists/etc.

J Andrew Patrick wrote:

> I'm getting really tired of being told "You can't post THIS!", "You can't
> post THAT!". The following quote is from the OFFICIAL DESCRIPTION of this
> discussion group, as published in Paul Gilster's excellent book,
> The Internet Navigator:
Well, I am certainly relieved to hear that there is an official
description of the Homebrew Digest -- this has been weighing on me
heavily. My only question is: "Who the hell is Paul Gilster and when
did he last participate in the Digest?"

J Andrew, the Digest is essentially run by consensus, not by Paul
Gilster, whoever he is, and there are some who feel that brewpub reviews
are not appropriate here. I didn't tell you that you "couldn't post
this!" (exclamation points or not) I appealed to the self-interest of
homebrewers, who might, like me, be tired of brewpub reviews clogging
the digest, which *officially* is a homebrew digest.

- --Jeff


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 11:37:17 -0600 (CST)
From: [email protected]
























Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 13:09:51 EST
From: "Glen A. Wagnecz, X6616"
Subject: NO-WELD boiler

I lost the article, but there was some discussion on keg fittings and
welding. I put together a 1/2 BBL set up without any welding. Here's
the summary (assumes you have de-pressurized the keg and removed the
ball-valve assembly, DON'T PROCEED UNLESS YOU ARE SURE!):

1. Mark the pattern/aquire a top. When your SO is out of the house,
go through the pots and lids and find an extra one that is about
10" in diameter. Trace the pattern of the lower lip (which has a
diameter slightly less than the exterior) on the keg top,
centering it.

2. Cut the top. I started by drilling a 1/2" pilot hole in the top,
about 2 inches from the side. I liked the idea of leaving the handles
intact, for purposes of moving (discussed later). Next, get a jig saw
or a sawzall and a pack of blades (you'll need them, SS is tough!).
The problem you will have is that if you use the jigsaw, curvature (sp?)
of the top tilts the saw; the sawzall is less bothered (be patient and
it'll work!).

3. Clean up the cut lip with either a fine file or some medium
sandpaper, being careful not to get splinters.

4. Drill the drain hole. You'll need about a 5/8 hole.
Locate the hole near the bottom but on the sidewall (about a 1/4"
from the bottom weld). Also, stay away from the 1/2" holes in the
bottom piece, because heat and flames will come out of them when you heat
the keg, which you don't want hitting your valve! What I used
for my set up was the following: 1/2 SS ball valve (Teel brand,
from grainger), a compression nut with an internal 1/2" pipe
thread, and one of those copper fittings that has a 1/2" pipe thread on
one side (outside) and the other side with a socket to solder in
a 1/2 pipe. What I did was to cut the compression nut such that I
had a 1/2" copper nut left without the part after the thread that
slopes down to the pipe diameter. Thread this onto the male thread
of the 1/2 MPT to 1/2 pipe adapter , leaving about 1/4" of thread
after the end of the nut. What you have just created is essentially
a heat-proof bulkhead fitting...

5. Push the threaded end of this assembly through the hole in the
keg from the inside out, so that the threaded end pops out of the
wall of the keg. Screw the 1/2 ball valve onto the protruding thread,
with some teflon pipe tape in between the keg wall and the valve.
I also had some teflon on the inside of the assembly, between the
interior of the keg and the nut.

Looks like this:
>>> enters female thread
of ball valve.
| (keg wall)

(Love ASCII, NOT!)

6. On the other side of the ball valve (presumably also a female thread),
I added a 1/2 MPT to a flare (compression) adapter, the right angle kind
(you want to drain straight down, right?). The reason I used the
compression fittings is because I sometimes like to use a hopback,
which also has a 1/2" line w/a flare and nut inlet/outlet, which in
turn connects to my COUNTERMERSE (TM) chiller. The COUNTERMERSE
consists of 30 feet of soft R-type copper (1/2") pipe. In the winter,
when snow is available, it sits in a bucket of snow and the hot wort
passes through the inside of the coil (takes about 8 buckets of NJ's
heavenly white to cool a 12 gallon batch). In the summer, I clean
it up and use it as an immersion cooler, using well water as a coolant.
Again, the compression fittings mate with an adapter from my sink. You
can do about two loads of laundry with the waste coolant water.

7. The handles. I left them on so that I can pick up the keg for a gravity
drain. In the beams of my cellar, I put a piece of rebar through the
floor beams and got a $20 come-along from Home depot. You can lift a
full 1/2 BBL with it and still have one hand left to hold a cold one...

8. Other notes. Reflux (boil just water) about 5 gallons to clean
the keg and to test for leaks. (Leave the top on). You may have to
tighten the drain a little more. You're done!


P.S. Another handy gadget is a dip stick with markings for the volume
etched in it (thanks to the HBD'er who suggested it awhile back,


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 13:16:23 EST
From: sdlsb::73410@sdlcc (Carl Howes)
Subject: sanitizing crockery

I recently tried a Bock called "Bock im Stien". I liked the beer, and I am
intrigued by the possibilities of reusing the stoneware bottle it came in,
especially if I can get many cheap. Is there anyone out there who has
tried this or has enough knowledge about stoneware who can tell me if these
can be reasonably sanitized? i.e. will my standard bleach solution do the
trick, or should I use heat, or just toss the idea? TIA.

[email protected]

P.S. These have a ceramic swingtop.


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 10:23:54 -0800 (PST)
From: [email protected] (Jeff Frane)
Subject: Brewpub list

If, indeed, the brewpub list is sadly out-of-date, perhaps someone (?)
could expend the effort to fix it. It seems to me it would also be a
good thing if a person could access a related source and search by city
or state, get a list of brewpubs (with addresses, etc.) and perhaps a
selection of reviews. People who had visited the Frothing Dog in
Killabong, New South Wales, f'rinstance could post their impressions
("no worries, mate, the beer's foul") and the interested inquirer would
see if it might be worth the trip.

I believe CompuServe maintains a good pub list (Robin!???); perhaps
they'd share.

- --Jeff


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 12:18 CST
From: [email protected]
Subject: Blowoff hoses

Tom writes:
>I would suggest at least a 1/4" hose at least 5' long...

I would recomend a blowoff hose at least 1/2" INSIDE DIAMETER for normal
beers and 1" INSIDE DIAMETER for fruit beers. 1/4" is destined to clog
and make an incredible mess (I know first hand). Even my 1/2" ID hose
was not wide enough to keep from clogging on a raspberry/cherry beer and
you should see what a couple of pounds of flying fruit will do to a wall...

The added advantage of the 1" ID (1.25" OD) hose is that you don't need
a stopper. All you need is to stick it into the neck of the carboy and
put the other end in a jug or bucket with a bit of boiled water in it
(no, I don't recommend bleach solution -- what if some gets sucked up
and into the carboy?). This works on 3-, 5- and 6-gallon glass carboys.
My understanding is that the 6.5- and 7-gallon necks are a bit different
in ID -- it still might work, though.



Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 12:32 CST
From: [email protected]
Subject: Techno-weenie books

I'm curious as to which books Laura feels are overly advanced for
beginners. I started with Charlie Papazian's "Complete Joy of Homebrewing"
and felt that although it was indeed intimidating to jump into the
brewing game, I did not feel that the writing was very technical, especially
in the Beginner chapters. "Technical" terms, such as "hydrometer" are
defined in simple English... see page 25 under "What's a Hydrometer?"
(I've got the New CJoHB, too, and have read it also, but am too lazy to
go find the page where hydrometers are explained.)

The other books out there (Miller's two books, Noonan's, George Fix's,
J.S. Hough's) perhaps may require more basic knowledge (although I think
that Miller's second book was written on a bit more basic level), but
after reading Papazian, I don't think they should be any trouble at all.

So, I feel that the "cookbook" version of the homebrewing text is already



Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 13:38:49 -0500
From: "Ronald E. Gill"
Subject: Reinheitsgebot

I have travelled extensively throughout the world, and of course all over
Germany (when it was West Germany), and I have come to the conclusion that
a good beer is where ever you find it (hopefully in front of your lips and over
the tongue!). In response to Dave Smucker where he said basically that you
will not find a bad beer in Germany, I have had the unfortunate experience
of finding a few bad beers in Germany! Beer is not only the way you brew it,
but also the way you treat it once it is fermented.

The Reinheitsgebot was enacted by Duke Albert IV of Bavaria that stated b that
beer would only be made with malted barley, hops, and water. There was no
mention of yeast in the Reinheitsgebot since yeast was not known to exist (the
year was 1516 so you have to give them a break). The purpose behind the law
was to protect the ordinary citizen from buying something called beer that was
made from other fermented products like beets or corn. Barley was an expensive
farm crop back then so that cheap breweries were using anything to make
something fermented. The Duke protected beer in Bavaria, and for the rest of
the civilized world from being a bodyless mass of liquid that has alcohol in
it. A good beer made anywhere in the world where the breweries do not follow
the reinheitsgebot still use a large portion of their mash as malted barley.


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 13:46:39 -0500
From: "Ronald E. Gill"
Subject: New Club at U. of Md.

There is a new club for home wine, mead, and beer makers at the University of
Maryland at College Park. It is named the Brewers and Vintners Guild. The Guild
is dedicated to bring to the campus community the historical and cultural
significance of fermented beverages and the helping of fellow members become
masters of the Zymurgists art. Meetings are held every two weeks in Tydings
Hall, room 0111 on Tuesdays from 6:30 til 8:30 PM. Any questions, email me at
[email protected]. I am a chemical engineering major with six years experience
in homebrewing. We plan on having tastings, competitions, and field trips to
local breweries and wineries. The Guild is open to all Students, Faculty, and
Staff of the U. of Md.

Thanks and Good Brewing,

Ron Gill, Master Zymurgist


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 12:29:37 -0700
From: Loren Carter
Subject: Contest Announcement

Contest Announcement
Eighth Annual
Gemstate Homebrew Competition

Entry Deadline: March 18, 1994

For more information send me your e-mail or snail mail address and I will send
descriptions, forms etc.

Loren Carter
[email protected]
Chemistry Department
Boise State University
Boise, Idaho


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 14:08:38 -0600 (CST)
From: BadAssAstronomer
Subject: brewpubs and beer

Hi all

Just to remind everyone what it says at the top of their digest
every morning:

Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

What can/cannot be discussed on the digest seems pretty clear to

So, on to more inportant things. I just heard about a mid-south
beer festival in Ft. Smith Arkansas. I think it is the first, so
probably no one has any opinions on it. Since this seems to be the
closest I'll get to a beer festival (living in Huntsville AL),
I've been thinking about going. Unfortunately, I've forgotten the
name of the place, but I believe it to be the only brewpub in Ft.
Smith. So, if anyone is interested, or has more information than I
do, please email me -- [email protected]



Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 12:25:13 PST
From: [email protected]
Subject: Ice Beer

>So for you, the few, the knowledgeable, please disperse with some bandwidth on
>the topic.

Real Ice brew is beer lagered at a temperature just above freezing. Probably
for a long time. I have tasted and fully enjoyed Niagra Falls Brewing
Company's Eisbock. I believe Labbatts brews their beer as they normally do,
but then chill it to just below freezing. This causes some of the water to
freeze into tiny ice particles, which is filtered out, leaving a more
robust(sic) beer. All the other beers with the name Ice in them are basically
chilled down to around freezing, and then filtered, no ice is removed(sounds
like cold filtering, nothing new), this is just an advertising executives idea
of 'ice brewed' beer. It has nothing to do with the brewing process, just a
band wagon to jump on. Nobody wants to be left behind again, as they were when
Miller invented the `Lite' beer.

God, I hate these commercial breweries, that's why I homebrew.



Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 14:15:19 EST
From: [email protected]
Subject: wyeast 2308

Here's a summary of replies received re Wyeast 2308 Munich lager yeast off
'A slight odor?'
'the sulfury smell is an EXPECTED transient odor that will pass with
continued fermentation, and should totally dissappear with lagering.'
'A sulfury aroma is not unusual during primary fermentation, especially in
lagers. It generally goes away.'
'After racking to secondary, I noticed a definite and pronounced
sulfur/yeasty note in the beer. The yeast cake at the bottom of the primary
was especially picquant.
On another related subject, experiencing a real lack of attenuation in this
strain. After three weeks in the primary, all batches seemed
to get stuck at around 2/3's of final gravity. fermentation going again after
racking to a secondary (keg) and rousing the yeast.'

Thanks for your input. My Pale Bock is coming along nicely. I haven't noticed
attenuation trouble before, though the sg seems stalled at 1.040 (og around
1.075 using 9lbs Laaglander xtra light dme and 3.5 lb specialty malt, I
didn't actually measure it)
I'll try rousing the yeast to see what happens.
Bob Talkiewicz, Binghamton, NY


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 94 13:03:24 PST
From: [email protected] (Tim Anderson)
Subject: Reinheitsgebot

In HBD #1358 Dave Smucker sez:

>In HBD #1355 Dan Z. Johnson comments about " Reinheitsgebot "
>and how there are good beers in countries without it. True,
>but have you ever had a BAD beer in Germany? Have you ever had
>a BAD BAD beer in the good old USA? Yep!! Enough said.

I'm glad that Germany has that R thing, and I'm glad that I live in a
country without it. I assume Celis White would be illegal, as would
Sam Adams Cranberry "Lambic". And if your local craft brewery decided
to try making a Chimay or Rochefort clone, it wouldn't be allowed.
America makes plenty of BAD beer, but like Velveeta Slices, I don't
much care. I simply choose to not buy it.

Yes, I think this is an appropriate topic for HBD.



Date: 25 Feb 94 21:04:19 GMT
From: [email protected]
Subject: Old coffee-machine Auto-spargers.

Back in HBD1333, Ed Hitchcock talked about his SPARGATRON 6000,
perhaps a little tongue-in-cheek. He proposed using an old coffee
maker to produce a constant supply of sparge water, and says his
implementation cranks out a steady 3 GPH of 150F water.

Well this got my curiosity piqued, so I scrounged up an old machine
and pulled out the business end. It seems that it's composed of an
in and out water pipe, passing through a heater element which is
governed by a thermostat of some sort. With a little tweaking and
insulating the thermostat from the heater I'm able to produce a
consistant flow of 165F water, perfect for sparging. The thing is
gravity fed, so flow is controlled by the height of the water on the
ingres side. Flow also affects temperature and with some fiddling
with a hose crimper on the output side, plus an equal flow out of
the lautertun the whole mess stays balanced between temperature and
flow rate. It takes about 2 minutes to set up. Kewl.

Now I have time to wade through todays HBD and finish a pint.
| Internet: [email protected]| "640K ought to |
| Glenn Anderson | be enough for |
| Manager, Telecom. Facilities | anybody." |
| Sun Life of Canada |-Bill Gates, 1981|


Date: Fri, 25 Feb 1994 15:12:27 -0700 (MST)
From: "Dale Leidheiser"
Subject: Recipes, etc.

Please send information/ files/ etc. !

End of HOMEBREW Digest #1359, 02/26/94


  3 Responses to “Category : Various Text files
Archive   : HBD135Z.ZIP
Filename : HBD1359

  1. Very nice! Thank you for this wonderful archive. I wonder why I found it only now. Long live the BBS file archives!

  2. This is so awesome! 😀 I’d be cool if you could download an entire archive of this at once, though.

  3. But one thing that puzzles me is the “mtswslnkmcjklsdlsbdmMICROSOFT” string. There is an article about it here. It is definitely worth a read: